Gérard Talbot

Hello Mark Wilton-Jones,

I've written an article on IE7, CSS 2.1 and I am quoting you in this webpage:

[URL]

I will eventually re-structure my own
[URL]
section and add many other bugs I found.

I will (starting this evening) also list your numerous webpage on IE7 bugs
(idem est: http://www.howtocreate.co.uk/wrongWithIE/)
at the bottom of
[URL]
and
[URL]
webpages.

We, web developers, need to stand connected+together and strong on this
issue. It's not good enough to want users to use Firefox 1.5+ or Safari
2.x or Opera 9+; we would need lots of amateur web authors to use better
editing tools, validators, etc..

Take care of yourself and please receive my warmest thanks for the
wonderful, useful, relevant website you maintain :)

Gérard Talbot
--
I truly agree with you when you say: "the latest IE release concentrated
on user interface, and security fixes and ignored the lack of standards
support."

On the vertical-align: middle bug, you say
{
The same applies to align="middle".
}

but you should instead say
{
The same applies to valign="middle".
}

Also, you say
{
Block elements no longer detect hover or click unless the mouse is over
some text within them (this is an old bug that got fixed in IE 7 and
broken again in IE 8).
}

but, in some particular cases, like links with style display: block in
some precise contexts, there were bugs in IE 7:
[URLs]


I have linked your IE 8 browser bug collection in my IE 8 bug webpage:

[URL]

Best regards, Gérard Talbot

Hello Tarquin,

Ok. You're right! :)
But CSS vertical-align: middle for table cells and valign="middle" for
table cells do not render as expected in IE 8 (I know I have tested for
those explicitly):

[URL]

At least, valign="middle" for table header cells is no longer the default
in IE 8.

For images, I have:
[URL]

> In the case of the bugs listed on my IE 8 page, they are only the
> regressions

Ok. Noted. This is also what I thought.

> failing in IE 8. Preparing a list of bugs that also affect earlier
> versions (such as your own list) is out of scope

I understand.
It took me basically 18-24 months to build my IE 7 bug collection ...
while trying to avoid repeating already reported elsewhere IE bugs in that
page.

Best regards,

Gérard Talbot

Hello Tarquin,

When I load
http://www.howtocreate.co.uk/ieBugs/doublebullet.html
in IE 8 beta 1 (XP Pro SP2), then there is no bullet point to the left of
the second sentence, and reloading the page does not change that. So, it
appears, at first, that the testcase is not demonstrating your issue...
But when I select/highlight (with the mouse, by mouse-dragging) the text
of the second sentence, then the list-marker bullet appears. The
list-marker bullet of the 2nd sentence also appears after double-clicking
a word in that sentence.

Furthermore, if I select/highlight (with the mouse, by mouse-dragging) the
list-marker bullet itself of that 2nd sentence, then the list-marker
bullet disappears.

I've tested this very carefully and I can reproduce these "phantomatic"
behaviors consistently: these behaviors are reproducible 100% of the time.

Speaking of list-markers appearing and disappearing, I have a testcase
that demonstrate such behavior:

If you hover the mouse cursor pointer over the text of links in these 2
testcases:

[URL]
[URL]

then you will see an extra, additional list-marker appearing in the
previous list-item. E.g. Hover the mouse over a 2nd link text and 2
list-markers will appear for the first list-item.

Regards, Gérard

Hello Tarquin,

Well, I use XP Pro SP2 and reloading does not make it appear. Just
informing you about this.

>> but it is a redraw issue.

IE 7 had some stacking bugs but now, it seems there are more layer
stacking bugs in IE8b1. I have several examples of this.

[URL]

[URL]
being one of the worse

>> There are multiple ways to produce the same bug

Just curious, Tarquin: do you see an extra, phantom list-marker when you
hover the mouse cursor over the 2nd link in this testcase:

[URL]

...and do you see extra, phantom list-markers appearing (at previous
list-item) when you hover the mouse cursors over the links in this
testcase:

[URL]

I'm wondering if you would be interested in linking your IE8b1 collection
of bugs webpage to mine.

One last question... but an important one. I'm more and more wondering if
creating a web ring of IE8 collection of bugs is an idea that people (like
yourself) would support and join. All that would be needed for
participants would be
- add a particular image (gif, png) indicating its participation into such
web ring of IE8 collection of bugs
- a participant would have to provide at least 2 bugs with respective
testcase
- a participant would have to list links to other web-ring-participants'
IE8 bug collections.

I'm pretty sure several others would join. It certainly would compensate
for absence of IE database bug reporting system (when such semi-public
online database is off) or its current miserability (poor usability, many
annoyances, many bugs being closed instead of being futured, etc.).

Bugs would have to be related to W3C web standards (or official standards
bodies), preferably stable, final and official releases (not working
drafts).

I dearly value W3C web standards. I personally use and prefer Firefox but
I certainly do not object or mind against other browsers, including IE,
achieving compliance, conformance of W3C web standards and more
correctness in its implementation of such web standards. I'm happy when I
read that Safari nightly build passes acid3 test or that an internal
nightly build of Opera passes acid3. I think all people who value web
standards should.

Best regards, Gérard